Ocean Grown - Vader OG

[bvolt]

Hi LL -

I don't use any nutes (sorta). This is organic supersoil and plain tap water (with some Mam-P and some organic bat guano). The supplements I use aren't capable of causing this type of reaction.

Not sure if you're new to LEDs, but this is a fairly common problem - light stress.

As for adding the monochromatic LEDs... I think with additional research, you will find that although blue and red light are "most" responsible for photosynthesis very few white LEDs contain the desired amounts of these wavelengths, particularly deep red (660nm) and furthermore - aside from photosynthesis, these other colors are believed to be responsible for a great many morphological responses.

Finally, I do have an Apogee SQ-512 to precisely measure my PPFD across the canopy. I'd started at 12" with a PPFD average of close to 1000 (850 around the edges) - I haven't taken new readings since raising the lamp.

[LivingLight]

Hi LL -

I don't use any nutes (sorta). This is organic supersoil and plain tap water (with some Mam-P and some organic bat guano). The supplements I use aren't capable of causing this type of reaction.

Not sure if you're new to LEDs, but this is a fairly common problem - light stress.

As for adding the monochromatic LEDs... I think with additional research, you will find that although blue and red light are "most" responsible for photosynthesis very few white LEDs contain the desired amounts of these wavelengths, particularly deep red (660nm) and furthermore - aside from photosynthesis, these other colors are believed to be responsible for a great many morphological responses.

Finally, I do have an Apogee SQ-512 to precisely measure my PPFD across the canopy. I'd started at 12" with a PPFD average of close to 1000 (850 around the edges) - I haven't taken new readings since raising the lamp.

I know pretty well how plants are working with photosynthesis and light and i'm growing under leds since 2012.
I've been experimenting a lot of different setups and as a scientist i'm reading a lot of studies on the photomorphogenesis and the photosynthesis.
The 660nm is a dangerous colour for people who believe in the internet's intox. It's a colour to use very carefully, specially for the flowering of short day plants. The balance of the spectrum is very important for such a purpose, and most of the growers beliefs lead them to build spectrums that are doing the opposite of what they want.

Now you told me you got an average of 1000PPFD with your spectrum, i understand you get into such troubles.
If you wanted to go so high in light density you should have kept a classical warm white only, or at least not use additional blue leds. And the red leds should have been balanced with far red leds

[bvolt]

Hi LL -

I don't use any nutes (sorta). This is organic supersoil and plain tap water (with some Mam-P and some organic bat guano). The supplements I use aren't capable of causing this type of reaction.

Not sure if you're new to LEDs, but this is a fairly common problem - light stress.

As for adding the monochromatic LEDs... I think with additional research, you will find that although blue and red light are "most" responsible for photosynthesis very few white LEDs contain the desired amounts of these wavelengths, particularly deep red (660nm) and furthermore - aside from photosynthesis, these other colors are believed to be responsible for a great many morphological responses.

Finally, I do have an Apogee SQ-512 to precisely measure my PPFD across the canopy. I'd started at 12" with a PPFD average of close to 1000 (850 around the edges) - I haven't taken new readings since raising the lamp.

I know pretty well how plants are working with photosynthesis and light and i'm growing under leds since 2012.
I've been experimenting a lot of different setups and as a scientist i'm reading a lot of studies on the photomorphogenesis and the photosynthesis.
The 660nm is a dangerous colour for people who believe in the internet's intox. It's a colour to use very carefully, specially for the flowering of short day plants. The balance of the spectrum is very important for such a purpose, and most of the growers beliefs lead them to build spectrums that are doing the opposite of what they want.

Now you told me you got an average of 1000PPFD with your spectrum, i understand you get into such troubles.
If you wanted to go so high in light density you should have kept a classical warm white only, or at least not use additional blue leds. And the red leds should have been balanced with far red leds

Perhaps, but where's the science?

[bvolt]

Hi LL -

I don't use any nutes (sorta). This is organic supersoil and plain tap water (with some Mam-P and some organic bat guano). The supplements I use aren't capable of causing this type of reaction.

Not sure if you're new to LEDs, but this is a fairly common problem - light stress.

As for adding the monochromatic LEDs... I think with additional research, you will find that although blue and red light are "most" responsible for photosynthesis very few white LEDs contain the desired amounts of these wavelengths, particularly deep red (660nm) and furthermore - aside from photosynthesis, these other colors are believed to be responsible for a great many morphological responses.

Finally, I do have an Apogee SQ-512 to precisely measure my PPFD across the canopy. I'd started at 12" with a PPFD average of close to 1000 (850 around the edges) - I haven't taken new readings since raising the lamp.

I know pretty well how plants are working with photosynthesis and light and i'm growing under leds since 2012.
I've been experimenting a lot of different setups and as a scientist i'm reading a lot of studies on the photomorphogenesis and the photosynthesis.
The 660nm is a dangerous colour for people who believe in the internet's intox. It's a colour to use very carefully, specially for the flowering of short day plants. The balance of the spectrum is very important for such a purpose, and most of the growers beliefs lead them to build spectrums that are doing the opposite of what they want.

Now you told me you got an average of 1000PPFD with your spectrum, i understand you get into such troubles.
If you wanted to go so high in light density you should have kept a classical warm white only, or at least not use additional blue leds. And the red leds should have been balanced with far red leds

Interesting info. Can you cite some sources? I like to do the research myself.

Thanks.

[LivingLight]

As i was already talking about this topic in another thread, i'll just quote myself
Also, it's fun as every time i'm advising to be carefull with the deep red in flowering stage, people are asking me for evidences. But is there any evidence of the opposite? I mean everyone is using the deep red for flowering but none is really able to say why or to quote any scientific study
I'm not saying you shouldn't ask for evidences, but i'm wondering if you get any study saying you should use more deep red for short day flowering

Phytochrome mediates the external light signal to repress FT orthologs in photoperiodic flowering of rice
Takeshi Izawa, Tetsuo Oikawa, Nobuko Sugiyama, Takatoshi Tanisaka, Masahiro Yano,
and Ko Shimamoto1, 2007

In this study on the rice (short day plant) the measurement on the flowering locus and the Constans messengersRNA for Phytochromes deficient mutants shows that the flowering gene is repressed both by the circadian clock genes depending on the day/night cycle (so indirectly depending on the phytochromes) and directly by the phytochrome activation during the day. That would means : the more you activate the phytochromes during the day, the more you delay flowering. In addition to the well known effect of phytochromes at the nightfall.
You could try to use a blurple and only add 730nm at nightfall, your flowering induction still willl be delayed compared to a full spectrum with lower phytochrome ratio.


Phytochrome-interacting transcription factors PIF4 and PIF5 induce leaf senescence in Arabidopsis
Yasuhito Sakuraba1, Jinkil Jeong, Min-Young Kang, Junghyun Kim, Nam-Chon Paek & Giltsu Choi, 2014

Here they literally says:
". ELF3 and phytochrome B inhibit
senescence by repressing PIF4/PIF5 at the transcriptional and post-translational levels,
respectively. PIF4/PIF5 act in the signalling pathways of two senescence-promoting
hormones, ethylene and abscisic acid, by directly activating expression of EIN3, ABI5 and EEL"
So basically, something that everyone should know, the phytochrome activation during the day delay senescences.
Whatever the origin of the senescence (age triggered, lack of food...)
Also if you've ever been using blurple this appear to be really obvious xD