noob to the LED game, looking to build multiple 4x4's

[Newtoled]

Yeah I can’t wait, just can’t choose spectrum so I reckon your right I might wait till they arrive in stock let the gurus do there thing and go from there as I figure it’s worth the wait.

[TEKNIK]

Yeah I can’t wait, just can’t choose spectrum so I reckon your right I might wait till they arrive in stock let the gurus do there thing and go from there as I figure it’s worth the wait.

They shouldn't be far off arrival, I will have time to test them next week if they come in.
It's always best to wait a little to be sure about these things, either option is going to be really good, I am just not sure how much punch the 660nm will have on the spectrum as they are really powerful in comparison to the previous model.
It maybe worth asking cutter if they can do a 5K optisolis/3K Cri80 nichia mix on the board, this should give the best of both worlds even if they charge a little extra to do it.

[Newtoled]

Thanks heaps mate. I’ll keep in touch can’t wait to see the results when they arrive should be more than interesting . I’ll have a chat with them. Appreciate your help

[Partisan]

I'm looking for a simple 4x4 design that can be built quite cheaply, but still knock out better than 1000w HPS type results.

In your opening post you mention that you want to have the same or even more light as a 1000w HPS.
But when I read further in the thread, I see that you bought a 480w driver.

As I understand it 480w in led does not equal 1000w HPS.
You would at least need something of around 600/650w led.

What are your (or anyone elses) thoughts about this?

[TEKNIK]

Depending on the end system 480W can be plenty for a 4X4. A 1000W HPS is often too much in a 4X4 unless you have a really high hang height it can have a negative effect

[unkle_psycho]

I'd say Teknik hit the nail on its head. For very large plants 480w right on top of the canopy will not be enough. For scrog it will be fine. Gives 50-60cm penetration on average.

[Partisan]

Depending on the end system 480W can be plenty for a 4X4. A 1000W HPS is often too much in a 4X4 unless you have a really high hang height it can have a negative effect

Ok, I agree with you there.

But just looking at it from a technical point of view: To replace a 1000w HPS, how much Watt led would one need?

[TEKNIK]

Depending on the end system 480W can be plenty for a 4X4. A 1000W HPS is often too much in a 4X4 unless you have a really high hang height it can have a negative effect

Ok, I agree with you there.

But just looking at it from a technical point of view: To replace a 1000w HPS, how much Watt led would one need?

It really depends on how the build is and how the grower decides to hang the lights, in general 600-700W can replace a HPS, HPS does have a few advantages in the spectrum that the plants seem to like such as 700-800nm also a fair bit below 400nm. One of the reasons led manufacturers pushed so hard about having PPFD so hard for the ranges between 400nm to 700nm is so they could make HPS and CMH look bad. There is alot of photosynthetic active radiation outside of the 400-700nm range. HPS has been used for a long time and often genetic selection under what grows best under HPS for the past 30 years plays a role, that will start to change though.

[Welight]

Bear in mind, 480 Watt Meanwells in A versions actually can crank to 560 watts as we found testing our SSK-550 kits yesterday, actually 569 watts, pushed 1300par at 18inches with new XPG-3 Deep reds
Cheers
Mark

[unkle_psycho]

Depending on the end system 480W can be plenty for a 4X4. A 1000W HPS is often too much in a 4X4 unless you have a really high hang height it can have a negative effect

Ok, I agree with you there.

But just looking at it from a technical point of view: To replace a 1000w HPS, how much Watt led would one need?

There is no straight forward answer. It's like how many horses does a car replace. Both can be used in so many ways, that you need to specify before answers have meaning.
It would be hard to beat what Heath Robinson does with HID's using equal watts. There are some led companies imitating the approach of high bay lighting (the most common way of using 1000w HIDs?) but I don't know if I ever even saw them discussed here.

Perhaps a more meaningful explanation on power would be commercial production houses that switch to LED, dropping power levels from 1000w to 650w, while increasing yield. For a more shallow canopy, studies by commercial producers suggest 480w. But those are lights producing maybe 2.5umol/w (650w x 2.5umol=1625ppf)... the xpg3 diodes welight was playing with produce over 3.8umol (1625ppf / 3.8umol=427.6w, so you would need 427.6w to produce the same ppf that commercial ops replace a 1000w HID with.

The form factor benefits of LED are greater then the efficiency benefits, when comparing to old lighting. I don't think were very far into how much our approach will change in the following decade, but a big part of that increase in yield comes from spreading the light out. Maybe these new gen LEDs are so efficient that I'm going to have to stop saying that.